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Reply to water and food between Tebbetts & McKittrick

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Reply to water and food between Tebbetts & McKittrick

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Ginnis from Rochester Hills, Michigan on 7/7/2012 10:25:27 PM:

Just rode the Katy from Sedalia to St. Charles. On the day that we were riding from Jefferson City to McKittrick, we discovered that there were no stores or restaurants between Tebbetts and Rhineland. We met the Sea to Shining Sea Riders (Disabled Vets riding across the U.S.) in Mokane (they were lunching at the trailhead), who gave us lots of water (thankfully). It was 105+ ... We ate at the Trailside Restaurant in Rhineland and that was reasonable and nice too. The trailguide is seriously outdated on this stretch of the ride.

Pam O from Independence on 7/7/2012 10:30:39 PM:

There is a bar and grocery store in Mokane and a bar in Portland. All are advertised in the trailguide. From experience they are all good places to stop.

Ginnis and Rook from Rochester Hills, Michigan on 7/7/2012 11:10:43 PM:

Many of the stores, bars, restaurants mentioned in the guidebook were out of business. Also, many were closed July 3-4. We had two current guidebooks between us and were surprised to discover that the information on this stretch was wrong. On hot days like we encountered, people could run out of water and suffer heat-related disorders.

Ginnis and Rook from Rochester Hills, Michigan on 7/7/2012 11:13:19 PM:

Yes, you are correct about the bar in Portland. It does not seem bike-friendly though - dark, smoky, etc. However, if one was desperate, one could get a drink there.

Darrell from Jeff City, MO. on 7/8/2012 6:20:05 AM:

That part of the trail is lacking in service options for sure. Doesn't do you any good now Ginnis, but to interject another place for others. If needed, within 75 or so feet of the trail, the little hut at Steamboat Junction Campground, mile 110.7, Bluffton has soft drinks, water and snacks, have never seen it not well stocked.

Just curious Ginnis, aside from the brutal heat, did you enjoy the rest of your trip?

Hank from New Haven, MO on 7/8/2012 8:35:39 AM:

I agree that this is a skinny stretch for services. However Portland Bar has always been very friendly to me. Smoky yes, but you can sit way in the back by the pool tables if you like. They have bottled water and other drinks for take-out.

Anonymous on 7/8/2012 11:03:02 AM:

Agree with Hank. Short on service in general along this stretch. Always have felt welcomed at Portland and had some good burgers there as well.

Jim from St. Thomas on 7/8/2012 1:44:35 PM:

A lot of the businesses on the Katy are Mom&Pop type places so they can have irregular hours especially on holidays. It's always a good idea if you're counting on services to be available for your ride to call ahead and verify that they will be open. Most of the places are very easy to deal with.

Cathy from Jefferson City on 7/8/2012 2:41:44 PM:

You are correct about there not being water available between Jeffersom City and Portland. Also as you emter some of these towns on the trail, like Mokane, the signage shows a faucet which makes you think there is running water at the trailhead and there is NOT a faucet anywhere. It is dangerous for people biking. Of course you have to carry your own water and be responsible and proactive. But with the kind of heat we have had this year it is difficult to carry enough water. I know money is tight but dang it we are talking about water availability. This trail is bringing more and more visitors to Missouri. DNR and other state agencies involved in tourism should a better job of making sure visitors to Missouri have what need .... WATER! These people spend time and money in our state. The least we can do is put a faucet in close proximity to the trailheads.

Trek on 7/8/2012 8:08:46 PM:

The map of Mokane shows a park on the south east side of town, is there a water spigot there? Steamboat Junction has always had something when we've pasted, and a chair to sit in.

savage24 from KC, MO on 7/10/2012 7:48:22 PM:

Ginnis, I'm sorry you missed what I consider one of the best stores along the trail. Loutre Market is just south of the trail on highway 19. The trail passes under MO 19 west of McKittrick and on the west side of the underpass there is a spur trail that you can ride up to the ample shoulder of the highway.

I agree with you on the water situation, I carry three water bottles on the bike but I would have wanted more to ride that stretch on the days you were there.

savage24 from KC, MO on 7/10/2012 7:54:28 PM:

Please disregard my comment about missing the Loutre Market. Thread title says Tebbetts & McKittrick and original post says Tebbetts & Rhineland. It's still a great store though!

Ginnis and Rook from Rochester Hills, Michigan on 7/11/2012 8:01:54 AM:

Yes .. I enjoyed the trail and the people were awesome. I have posted super positive stuff (recommendations) everywhere - here and in TripAdvisor. However, given the potentially dangerous effects of heat, people should be aware of the lack of water and food. IMHO, the Katy Trail State Park should produce a guide at least every other year. People come to the trail with a guide that has 2008 information. With many of those businesses closed, it sets people up for trouble. We were lucky to encounter the Sea folk (riding the road) who gave us several bottles of water.

Ginnis and Rook from Rochester Hills, Michigan on 7/11/2012 8:07:19 AM:

Thanks Cathy. You are spot on. I loved the trail but I am sure everyone would want to avoid having ambulances pick up people with heat stroke. In this recent heat, I consumed 3 L of water in the first 2-3 hours. About a liter an hour. Because I expected services every 5 miles (per book), I did not fill the other two bottles I had with me. Lucky for me that some guardian angels were placed in my path!!!

Paul K from Florissant on 7/12/2012 7:59:39 AM:

Hey Ginnis! My partner and I met you at the McBaine Trailhead. I was the one with the Canada Jersey ( I did wear it the next day). We made it to Clinton and back to St. Charles - 468 miles in nine days. We had a great time and met many great people. Like you, I am going to post more about our ride. We did not have any water issues but we stopped any place we could to keep our bottles and CamelBaks full. Tell Rook heh!

Anonymous on 7/12/2012 11:42:41 AM:

As I suspected. A few closed stores, an outdated guidebook, and the DNR do not keep people from getting water. Choosing to ride on without stopping to fill bottles may cause you to run out of water and suffer heat-related disorders.

It's not always someone elses fault that you run out of water. You can lead a horse to water, but you know the rest.

Ginnis from Rochester Hills on 7/12/2012 2:52:16 PM:

We didn't run out - but we encountered other people who had. It's just a heads up. Also, the distance between water options is long enough to necessitate 4-5 liters total in whatever combination of containers, which not every one carries. Look, I am trying to help people stay out of trouble. We were fine. I am not trying to engage in a snarky or contentious discussion and it's too bad some people react that way. Oh well.

Ginnis from Rochester Hills on 7/12/2012 2:55:06 PM:

Hi Paul!! Cool about your ride!!!! Rook will be glad to hear that you wore your Canada jersey in honor of Canada Day! We had a great ride. With this heat, I just wanted to let people know that a lot of information is inaccurate and go prepared with lots of water!!

Cathy from Jefferson City on 7/12/2012 4:06:02 PM:

I agree with Ginnis. I have had 5 16 oz water bottles when I left Jeff City heading east. I drank over 2, gave 2 away to people that were not prepared for the heat and lack of water, and I barely got back to Jeff City with any water. That day I just road to Tebbets (where there is no water for Katy Trail users) and then returned to Jeff City. I have encountered people needing water multiple times. There should be running water at least every 10 miles. If DNR is willing to tackle this problem, I would be happy to participate in group discussions about possible solutions.

Giinnis I am so glad you had a good time on the trail. Come back and see us some time!

Dawn Fredrickson, Katy Trail Coordinator on 7/13/2012 10:10:44 AM:

All, thanks for the comments about the need for water at all the Katy trailheads. We agree with the comments and it is a goal of ours to eventually add water to some of our trailheads, as funding allows. The Katy Trail guidebook mentioned in several of the posts is not a DNR publication. We maintain a grid of services on our website (www.katytrailstatepark.com -- click on "Trail Services" on the lower right hand corner of the screen) and on our Katy Trail brochure. The grid breaks out services by whether we provide them or whether they are provided by the community, either by a business, park, etc. Green dots on the grid are services we provide; blue dots are services the communities provide. Also, the trail community signs you see on the trail reflect this color-coding; trail service icons in green indicate services we provide and blue icons indicate services that the communities provide. We try to maintain as accurate a database as possible but, if you find a business that is closed that we still list on our website, please don't hesitate to contact us -- we really appreciate this type of information! I can be reached via email at dawn.fredrickson@dnr.mo.gov.

Anonymous on 7/13/2012 10:55:38 AM:

I am not trying to engage in a snarky or contentious discussion either. And it's too bad some people perceive that as so.

Until there is a windfall of money and the DNR can afford to put water at all the trailheads, the facts remain the same.

A few closed stores, an outdated guidebook, and the DNR do not keep people from getting water. Choosing to ride on without stopping to fill bottles may cause you to run out of water and suffer heat-related disorders.

It's not always someone elses fault that you run out of water.

Ginnis from Rochester Hills on 7/13/2012 11:59:37 AM:

But we didn't run out, as I stated earlier. My message was meant to alert riders who may not be familiar with this part of the trail about the paucity of options. Also, if it is your first time on the trail, some of the off-trail options are not evident. I rode around a number of towns looking for open businesses and usually didn't find any (except for the bar mentioned earlier). Water needs at 110 differ from those at 80, or even 90 .. hoping to avert someone's misadventure. That's all. Just a clarification.

Ginnis from Rochester Hills on 7/13/2012 12:04:04 PM:

Cathy -- Thank you!! It's nice to know that people are on the trail helping riders. When we come from out of state - we are relying on the trail guide and the signs. I know I left that morning thinking we'd be fine, because the guide states that there are stores and restaurants every 5 miles, which of course is outdated.

I had a wonderful time on the trail. The people I met were AWESOME. Except for one of the B&Bs I stayed in, everyone accommodated our early departure, bike bath, and water needs (freezing bottles for us). I will be back to ride the trail. :)

Ginnis from Rochester Hills on 7/13/2012 12:07:56 PM:

Dawn -- Thanks for your information. I used the online version whenever I could, but sometimes I could not get a signal (AT&T). But I did use that in addition to all the other resources. Have you seen the Great Allegheny Trailguide. It's published annually. I'm sure it's a huge endeavor, but it is very helpful for riders from all over. I met all kinds of people riding the trail as part of their ride across the U.S. too!! Bicycling is taking off .. Thanks!!!!

Anonymous on 7/13/2012 1:20:25 PM:

Did you contact the book publisher to let him know that there are errors in the book? Most of here have no control over those errors.

Ginnis from Rochester Hills on 7/13/2012 4:26:22 PM:

Thank you Anon. My post was to offer information for riders not familiar with this section of the trail so that they could prepare adequately, particularly when riding in 100+ weather - not to point fingers and so on. I apologize to you and anyone else who may have assumed that my goal was to point fingers - that was not my intention. That said, we are on the same page. I'm sure the author of the trail guide is aware, given the latest edition was published in 2009. Thanks for your comments, Anon.

Jim from St. Thomas on 7/13/2012 4:47:20 PM:

Don't worry about upsetting the various Anons on here. It's good to remind folks that you can't assume that all sections of the trail are the same when it comes to services etc.

Darrell from Jeff City, MO. on 7/14/2012 6:41:02 AM:

Thanks for bringing attention to this situation, Ginnis. The information is helpful to all!

KR on 7/20/2012 11:16:46 AM:

Looks like this subject got a rise out of many. The DNR and this site always has notices for trail conditions, river levels, and other precautions. These 100+F temp days are unusual and with that most KT riders know to carry large amounts of fluids including water. I rode the entire trail the first week of July. Bottles are inadequate for these temps especially in that "desert" section. A water bladder with larger amounts is what most people use and I imagine the SSS riders had bladders, right Ginnis? The bladder has fluids for internal and external cooling. Experienced riders anywhere rely on their own capabilities and controllable conditions and not those published or not. 1st choice water stops and restaurants and back-up, extra portable fluids and snacks. I also believe since the economy and state govt. are hurting some park donations or charged fees could help with water in this area. Lessons learned Ginnis.

Ginnis from Michigan on 8/5/2012 8:27:21 PM:

Yep .. Between us my friend and I had 2 x 2 liter blatters; two bottles that kept ice all day (amazing new things), and 3-4 extra bottles that we usually froze the water in the night before. That said, when it gets to 105, it's pretty easy to go through 1-2 liters an hour. Just a headsup about a section that we thought would have more water. We were fine.

Ginnis from Michigan on 8/5/2012 8:30:17 PM:

Loved the trip (just posted a link to the photos and you can't tell we were dealing with highs of 105 to 115). It's a wonderful treasure, and the people we met along the way were just awesome!

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