Katy Trail Forum

I have just had my second bad experience at the Trailside Cafe. I have not posted any comments prior to this one. I will say that it was with the same employee who is very rude and obviously is not concerned about return business. This person shouldn't be dealing with the public.



This past Friday evening my family went to Rocheport for a bike ride on the trail. We got there around 6:15. My wife is in the market for a new bike and I like the bike shop there so we stopped in to ask about new bikes and rent one for a test ride. The employee in question would not rent us a bike because there was not a full hour left in the day even though we said we would pay for the full hour. He also would not show us the new bikes. He was very rude about it and we felt somehow we were imposing on him by wanting to spend our money there. We were the only ones in the shop.



We had planned a nice evening of riding on the trial with our three kids and then having something to eat at Trailside.



My first bad experience with Trailside was on an extremely hot evening when I stopped in after my ride. My blood sugar got very low and I really needed a candy bar. As I walked up the board walk from the parking lot a man came out carrying a bucket. I said Hello. No responce but he was busy. As he walked back by and into the cafe I said, "Excuse me" and he turned and very rudely yelled, "WE'RE CLOSED!" and slammed the door.



I have had many, many good experiences at The Trailside Cafe and Bike Shop. They used to serve an excellent blackberry cobbler. This was years ago when the original couple owned it. They were always very nice and went our of their way to make people feel at ease.

I will probably still go to Trailside but not if I see this employee. The bike shop and employees there are very nice, knowledgeable and friendly.

Note that the shop closes at 7 though the website has the hours until 8. Which really means the bike rental closes at 6, which would helpful information to have posted on the website.



I am struck by the poor customer service we recieved. We are supposed to be in a bad economy with businesses shutting down all over the country. I wonder if what has happened to a lot of businesses is that people have gotten tighter with their money and are no longer willing to spend it anywhere that the service is poor. We are regulars to the Katy Trail but this employee didn't know where we were from or if we had any other experience at the Trailside Cafe. If it had been a first time experience...I would never return.

If you are open mined enough to return to the business after a couple of bad experiences, why would you never go back had the bad experience been a first time experience?



I would think after a bad first experience, you would also give a business the benefit of the doubt.

Daily Katy Trail User and Wife



Why don't you just stop going there - it sounds like it would be mutually beneficial.

Trek - You are apparently bound to dispute any negative comments.I would ask you to read the comments, location and how often we use the trail. My husband has been to Trailside MULTIPLE times and had the bad experience that he described. Did you read his last paragraph

"I have had many, many good experiences at The Trailside Cafe and Bike Shop. They used to serve an excellent blackberry cobbler. This was years ago when the original couple owned it. They were always very nice and went our of their way to make people feel at ease.

I will probably still go to Trailside but not if I see this employee. The bike shop and employees there are very nice, knowledgeable and friendly." How is that not a positive comment? We are describing an employee that was RUDE. Plain and simple. We are intelligent enough to not judge a business by one employee...but since it was the same person both times, felt the OWNERS should know. If I owned the business, I would want to know how my customers were being treated. So if your not the employee we are talking about, I don't see the relevance of your comment.

From Gary near Tebbetts MO:

Daily Katy Trail User and Wife



Why don't you just stop going there - it sounds like it would be mutually beneficial.



To Gary:

I believe our posts clearly stated that we have been customers on MULTIPLE occassions...my husband had one bad experience...then we had another last Friday. Both with the same employee. Felt if the Owners read the feedback we would want to know as owners. We are locals..supporters of the Katy Trail and our comment about a "first experience" was based on the many people that may stop there for the first time and if they experienced what we have on 2 of MULTIPLE occassions by the same employee - they would not return. Not sure why you felt giving us advise to not go there anymore would be "mutually beneficial". Our comments were honest feedback...just feel OWNERS should know how customers feel. Maybe we will see you on the Katy Trail or participating in the MS150 since you are passionate enough to comment on feedback that was honest, with no alternative motive, we then assume you are also out there giving back to the community...

From Gary near Tebbetts MO:

Daily Katy Trail User and Wife



Why don't you just stop going there - it sounds like it would be mutually beneficial.



To Gary:

I believe our posts clearly stated that we have been customers on MULTIPLE occassions...my husband had one bad experience...then we had another last Friday. Both with the same employee. Felt if the Owners read the feedback we would want to know as owners. We are locals..supporters of the Katy Trail and our comment about a "first experience" was based on the many people that may stop there for the first time and if they experienced what we have on 2 of MULTIPLE occassions by the same employee - they would not return. Not sure why you felt giving us advise to not go there anymore would be "mutually beneficial". Our comments were honest feedback...just feel OWNERS should know how customers feel. Maybe we will see you on the Katy Trail or participating in the MS150 since you are passionate enough to comment on feedback that was honest, with no alternative motive, we then assume you are also out there giving back to the community...

Okay....nix my first question. It's too hot out for that one.



Here's a new one though beings you feel so strong about the experiences encountered with said employee. Did you tell the owner of the business?

We posted a comment assuming the owners read the feedback. Would have done so on the business' website but is is under construction. I believe our feedback is clear and no further replies to your comments will be placed.

Knowing their website was under construction, and it has been for some time now, I don't know that I'd assume that they are big web users. Without airing your complaints with Larry, all that has happened is that the users here know that someone has a beef with a mystery employee. Probably nothing has been done to solve the problem.

Trek,



Get a job other than disputing constructive critism about which you have no first hand knowledge.

I have an idea...what don't you tell your buddy Larry. I'm sure he knows who was working Friday evening. For all I know it was Larry.

I've no plans to be in Rocheport anytime soon....you all are local and could probably better handle it yourselves.

If you are in the market for a Raleigh bike go to the Hartsburg Cycle Depot in Jefferson City and let Pam and Mark Allchorn fit you for a bike, They are NEVER HATEFUL OR SURELY and they KNOW BIKES! They are across from West elementary School.

I dunno about all that. Most business owners understand that an unhappy customer is much more likely to complain to their own friends and neighbors than to take their complaint to the owner. So a business owner who really wants to be successful will do all they can to solicit and seek out any complaints. A business owner who really wants to be successful will keep an eye on their employees and seek out feedback on them, because every action an employee takes, is done as a representative of that business owner.



If you are treated rudely at a business, especially if it happens twice like in this case, then you have every right to warn others to avoid that business. And you really have no obligation to seek out the owner. It would be nice to do, but most peoples’ lives are far too busy to take on the responsibility of being some business owners’ eyes and ears.



If Larry can’t run his business well by hiring non-abusive employees, then it’s his own self-inflicted problem. That sounds harsh, but running a business puts you out there in a harsh world. Mistreated customers really have no obligation to track him down and let him know.

It's not difficult to seek out an owner or manager on the spot when you receive poor product or service. I'm more inclined to tell the owner/manager at the time of my dissappointment than to try to tell the world behind their back later on. Doing so after the fact requires much greater effort for me. Otherwise, I just figure someone had a bad day and if it wasn't a big enough deal for me to speak up at the time, then I should just give them the benefit of the doubt and move on.

Larry might have bigger problems than an abusive employee. http://www.columbiatribune.com/news/2010/aug/13/suspected-burglars-kick-in-door-at-deputys-house/

I guess things are just done differently here in Oklahoma. If a business stops renting at 6 then we assume that this is when they stop renting. If a store is closed I wouldn't dream of asking them to reopen for me. If you live in the town then why wait until 6:15 to go look at bikes? Wouldn't you want time to really look over the bikes, it doesn't seem that 45 minutes would be enough time for that. The towns small enough that you surely knew the closing times ahead of time. I wouldn't wish bad customer service on anyone but I also wouldn't wish bad customers on any clerk. I know that most stores have rules about reopening once they've closed for the day, even if it's just to sell a candy bar. I have worked in retail and customer service for 20+years and once the store is closed it's closed.

Anybody find a red digital camera?

We are new owners and are currently open with limited items. The Grand Opening is scheduled for September 11th and 12th, 2010. Happy Trails!

Wishing you much success in your new business.

So, are you in the train car just east of hwy 47 on the trail? Good luck with your business!!!!

Ray, Yes, K.T. Caboose is the same location/railcar as Choo Choo's was. I went by there last week. Hopefully, the new owners will email you their hours and contact info so you can update this site.

My wife and I stopped there the last two days. Noreen is very friendly and is excited to be open for business. She makes her own ice cream, which is very nice on a 100 degree day. She has big plans to add services and it sounds as if Marthasville is coming alive with new businesses. I sure hope so! You will want to stop by and check out her four person Surrey quadracycle that she rents out by the hour or the day.

My whole family just visited the Caboose tonight! Yummy treats on a hot night in August! Way to go Noreen! We'll be frequent customers!

A must stop on the Katy Trail excellent products and service. Thank you Noreen for the water and ice cream on a very hot August day.

They have yummy shaved ice and some healthy alternatives too. Come check them out!

Since some of the recently posted comments are floating around lost in cyberspace, I wanted to repost my comments letting people know Noreen is open for business and sells some wonderful homemade ice cream. Also check out her Surrey quadracycle she rents by the hour or day. I hope Marthasville is coming alive for the Katy.

I love the Caboose! I'm very happy that Marthasville has some other creative people beginning businesses besides me...I'm the one with the ORANGE building soon to be Coyote Bones Cafe and Enchanted Wine Garden. I applaud Noreen and her family for all the hard work, so far, that they have put into the business. Way to go girlfriend! Everyone looking for a sweet treat and even some healthy items please stop by the Caboose in marthasville.

You may have noticed a time gap in the comments here on the forum. My #%!$ web hosting company messed up the database, for the second time, and about 6 weeks of data was lost (i.e. 6 weeks of comments). I'm trying to find a way to recover the lost data, but am not optimistic.



I apologize for the inconvenience. I am planing to move BikeKatyTrail to a better web hosting company soon. If you are looking for a website hosting company, stay far away from WebHost4life. Their lack of competence or reliability have been horrible lately.

Thanks for all your efforts Ray. You do a great job on this site and provide a valuable service for all of us. In the meantime, just think of this setback as the ability to go back in time. Any chance of rolling back to the sixties?

I can relate to this frustration. I recently had a website highjacked and it is no fun. I too appreciate all Ray does for the Katy Trail. I think every business and town along the trail owes Ray a huge thank you for all he does. I believe many businesses would be lost if not for the mention they receive on this site.

Luckily I was able to recover pretty much all the forum back through mid-July, and then a smattering of others before that. And everything up through mid-June is still intact.

Thanks for the compliments, and sorry again about the forum threads that I was not able to recover.

Ditto on the kudos above, Ray -- you and your innovative web sites are real gems in the cyclying universe! Thanks also for the tip on your web host, although you probably should have avoided mentioning that until you get moved to a new one! :-)

Ray, this forum is so positive. I don't know how it ends up that way, if you monitor it closely, or what. But I find the discussions are so much more positive than other forums I look at. I love bicycling on the Katy Trail (although the heat has kept me at home a lot this year). But I constantly look at this forum and the comments because I won't have to see negative, discouraging discussions. The little bit of fussing I see is minor. Thanks for doing such a great job.

Thanks folks, I appreciate the compliments. Yes Cathy, I too am amazed at how positive this forum is. I take a "hands-off" approach as much as possible, and very rarely - maybe once a year or so - do I ever have to handle inappropriate comments or flame wars. Katy Trail people are just a good bunch of people.

I noticed the description of my rooms for rent is no longer under my name. Is there any way to get this back on? Also some people have commented on my place it appears on the comment forum but not on my description. I only mention this because they were positive comments:-)Thanks for the great job. We love meeting the people biking the trail, what a hardy bunch of folks. Thanks Maxine. "Maxine's rooms for rent".

We are traveling from Ohio by car and need to rent bikes. Any suggestions, please, if we only have time to ride 20 miles one way on Katy trail, then return back again, what is the most scenic part of the trail near a bike rental?

depending on where you are on the KATY, rocheport then east

I would agree with Rocheport heading East is the most scenic and it is very easy to reach from I-70 if you are headed on toward KC. However, in my opinion (and it appears to be that of many others) the best place to rent a bike on the trail is Katy Bike Rental in Defiance, close to the East end of the trail. Bike rentals @ $5 per hour and they are almost new bikes and the people are very friendly.

You probably already know the Trailside Cafe and Bike Shop in Rocheport rents bikes. Click Rocheport on the above map for more info. Enjoy.

When are you planning on doing your ride? If you are going to go to Rocheport and rent from the Trailside Cafe, be sure and check on when Trailside is open. I think they are closed on Wednesdays. If you are going to arrive on Thursday, then they should be open and able to take care of you. Going east from Rocheport is one of the best parts of the trail.

My husband and I are wanting to go for a ride on the Katy Trail. We are getting ready to purchase bikes, but not sure what to get. I really want to get a cruiser bike with the comfy seat and handlebars, as we will be riding around our little town with our children as well and these are more comfortable and eye appealing to me. But is a mountain bike better for the trail? Are there lots of hills or rough terrain? Plus, I am getting kinda worried about all the comments of changing tires and bike repair and such. Just wanted to go for a lovely ride on the trail as far as we could make it and then stop for a stay in a B&B for the night and probably head back the next day. Of course, we won't tackle this until we are in shape from riding locally. We owned mountain bikes in the past, but not sure what kind to get. Don't want to make a huge investment in bike riding because we have other hobbies like horseback riding and camping that takes up most of our time. Just wanted to give it a try. Any pointers or bike suggestions are highly welcomed! Thanks so much! Oh, also, is the trail good for children (on shorter rides of course)?

My suggestion on the bike itself is to try to have more of an open mind. The cruiser bikes are actually pretty uncomfortable in general (I'm told) if you take them beyond very small distances (3-5 miles), which you will likely do if you're going on the Katy. This is because of that seat, along with the style of handlebars, since you don't get very many possible positions to move in while riding. But if you plan on keeping to short distances, it might be a consideration.



Then I understand from the cruiser bikes I've seen, that the gearing options are pretty limited, and you wouldn't want that in most generic riding situations in MO (small steep rolling hills, some flats). This won't be an issue on the Katy since it is made from an old railroad bed. But I wouldn't make a bike purchase choice based simply on one possible ride you could take. I would consider something that will be useful for most purposes and will still be suitable when you grow in riding if you persist in it.



On changing tires and bike repair, we bring it up because it's a fact of life in cycling. If you ride long enough and far enough from home, you will get a flat tire while riding and will need to be able to fix it. You also might want to carry some tools for other minor maintenance like adjusting brakes. But changing tires is about 90% of the on-road maintenance and a necessity if you go anything beyond short distances.



As far as it being "good for children", it depends on how apt/willing they are. I would definitely suggest creating good incentive to make it enjoyable for them. But there's nothing that unsuitable on the Katy that a child couldn't ride it.



Hope that helps.

I would agree with the previous comment about the cruiser. Even though the grades are relatively low on the Katy, you need some gearing. I would reccomend that if you are opposed to a mountain bike that you consider a hybrid. To enjoy the Katy you need to ride in comfort. As to repairs, I have not done as many miles as others on this forum, but I have completed two end to ends and major portions on other rides without any flats or mishaps. But I always ride prepared and I know that I will eventually have a flat. It just comes with the fun. Luck.

Ok. Thanks guys. That helps. I wasn't thinking of the trail being an old railroad track bed, duh, so of course its pretty level and the grades are long and low. As far as the bike goes, I guess I'd be better off with a mountain bike with a bigger seat, (I just hate those skinny little seats that come on them LOL). My town is hilly as well and I do know it's hard to avoid hills in MO! Thanks again!

I would like to give my humble opinion here. I would only purchase a mountain bike if I intended to use it as a mountain bike. The wider tires, suspension, and added weight are not needed for the road or paved trails. It is amazing how much more work one has to do on a mountain bike compared to other types of bikes. I like the thought of a hybrid and one that is purchased from a bike store so the bike can be custom fitted to you and thus more comfortable. And, the key to a comfortable saddle is not in it being big and cushy, but the right size. A bike store can help you with that and maybe sell you some padded shorts as well.

On Mountain bikes, they're generally fine, I've found. The biggest issues with them, though, are the suspension (very hard to use, and unnecessary in most cases) and the added weight (because of durability to take it off-road).



If you consider touring beyond just a day where you need to carry things (water, food, clothes, and so on), you will want wider tires than the norm, because they will need to handle the weight you carry (your weight plus gear).



The bike store suggestion is great, they should be able to explain all the factors involved in selecting a bike and should help you be able to find something that fits well for you and will satisfy all the requirements you need.

Terry is right.. Recommend a hybrid..And spend a little money, you will get so much more in return. Would you buy a pair of cheap shoes that doesn't fit? Kind of the same. Whole point is give your self the experience of enjoying the trail. Go to a big city bike shop with a lot of choices. Listen to the guys there.

Undisputable facts about riding:



Seats: Virtually no one ends up with the seat that came on the bike. Do as others do, start with that one and adjust from there. You don't know until you have ridden it for a few hours



Flats: They happen and just as likely 10 feet from your driveway as 40 miles out on the trail. At least have spare tubes on every ride.

Another consideration is to rent a bike. I've seen rentals lately that are designed to accomodate average riders that have rear hubs like the old 3 speeds had. These bikes have 8 gear options.



Although they add weight, I use HD Slime tubes with vinyl liners b/c I hate flats. I often ditch off the trails onto dirt trails where briars easily cause flats. I DO always have a tube with me.



For newbies, ass pain is gonna happen with any seat until you build up some mashed meat muscle.That alone keeps me riding all winter. I hate to re-condition my butt. Do lunges!lol!

I totally disagree with the comment stay away from cruiser, I have a Electra townie ride the Katy quite a bit anywhere from 25-50 miles at a time and just love my cruiser as do others that I ride with. Its upright seating position and pedal forward design can't be beat as far as I'm concerned for riding and enjoying the trail.

Go to a big city bike store that has a wide selection. You will miss out on looking at many models in a small town shop. I always ride my Trek Hybrid on the trail. Get at least a middle grade bike.

My vote goes to the hybrid or comfort bike.

I have to agree with the folks advocating a hybrid or comfort bike --

the less weight the better. I've ridden parts of the Katy on a trial

bike (heavy) with fat tires and a cushy seat and on a true road bike

with 700x23C tires. The road bike with its racing saddle was far more

comfortable. But my dream bike for the Katy would be a hybrid with

700x28 tires to handle the crushed stone a bit better. Don't get one of

those huge seats. They look comfy, but aren't. Get a good saddle from

good shop, a pair of padded shorts and some chamois butter.

I've done the entire trail twice, once with a comfort bike, and once with a cross/hybrid without the high handlebars, wide padded seat and shocks.



The comfort bike trip was the LEAST comfortable. The high handlebars left my shoulders aching and the padded wide seat chafed horribly.



The narrow seat and lower handlebars on the cross/hybrid gave a MUCH more comfortable ride and was much easier on my back in the long run.



For my money, the comfort bike is NOT comfortable for more than short rides.