Katy Trail Forum

One question. When is this years Wild on the Katy ride

June 16-20. This year the theme is "Ride West".
You'll probably have other questions, and most answers can be found here: http://www.mostateparks.com/katytrail/2008ride.htm

http://www.mostateparks.com/katytrail/



And my husband and I (and my dad) snagged rooms in Hartsburg at the Globe Hotel! Bada-bing! :)



Finally, it seems more real. I can now focus on getting into shape for the ride.

My friend and I are driving to St. Louis this summer and taking the train from Kirkwood to Sedalia. Then we will ride back to St. Charles. Does anyone know a safe route to ride our bikes from St. Charles to the Kirkwood train station? We were also planning to park our car for about 5 days in Kirkwood, maybe a rental space? Does that sound reasonable?

Check out the Kirkwood page for some route suggestions between the Katy Trail and Kirkwood.

My wife and I followed the route below (mentioned elsewhere in the forum) with a twist toward the beginning:



From the Page Bridge and Creve Coeur Park Connector Trail, take the following roads:

SE on Marine Ave.

Straight on Westport Plaza Dr.

Straight on Craig Rd.

Left on Olive Blvd.

Right on Mosley Rd.

Left on Ladue Rd.

Right on Spoede Rd.

Right on Clayton Rd.

Left on Geyer Rd.

Left on Argonne Rd.



Our variation was suggested elsewhere online, where you avoid the "infamously" steep, narrow, windy Marine Avenue up from the park. The suggested alternative had us go south on Creve Coeur Mill Road away from the park, then turning left onto Amiot Drive. Amiot will take you more gradually and safely up to the top of the ridge where you will meet up with Marine Avenue.



However, there's a problem. When this alternative was mentioned to us, it did say you would turn off Creve Coeur Mill into a parking lot, pass over or under a cable barrier and then ride up Amiot. It did NOT mention that the parking lot is for an apartment complex with multiple signs discouraging cyclists from using it as access to Amiot. The parking lot is essentially the road end of Amiot blocked off with a cable. Take away the cable and there's no reason cars (or bikes) couldn't go right through. I certainly can't recommend using that route given the situation. On the other hand, it is "better", in many respects, than going up the hill on Marine Avenue.



By the way, the route from Marine Avenue to Kirkwood Amtrak is very good for urban riding. A little up and down at times, but nothing as hard as getting up the hill from the river at the start. Plus, you go by some VERY nice homes.

Living in Kirkwood we see cars parked at the Amtrak station daily. They have a parking lot just for the station. Also, across the street from the station is a parking garage which always has plenty of parking. That I know of there are no posted signs not allowing extended parking at either place. Unfortunately, if you are wanting to ride to the end/start in St. Charles you will have to back track to the Page bridge to get a safe route back to Kirkwood unless you can find a ride accross the brige in St. Charles. The posted Route 4 is probably the best option they have listed with Marine being the only problem and other roads are good to ride.

I would like to ride the entire Katy Trail. Does anyone know, is Washington the closest Amtrak stop to the east side of the trail? I understand Warrensburg is the closest to Clinton.

For the east side of the trail, I would think the Kirkwood station in St. Louis or the downtown station would be closest to the eastern terminus in St. Charles. I think on the western end, Sedalia is the spot where most riders get off Amtrak. But Warrensburg would be close, too.

Check out this site's Amtrak page:

http://www.bikekatytrail.com/amtrak.asp

It is hard to get to the Katy Trail from Warrensburg, I would recommend Sedalia. It would be much better to ride the trail on to clinton and backtrack to Sedalia

I know for fact I cannot make this ride in it's entirety. I would love to know more about how it goes and could do 2 or so days. not trying to be a cheap skate but what would prohibit a guy from just tagging along for 2 days without paying. ( I would bring my own gear,food and camp would not dream of using any resources others have paid for) I have done the moonlight ramble and notice many wait outside the start and just ride along. I pay every year because I believe in their cause, but inthe above mentioned case I just want to meet some people and budget the time for the complete supported ride maybe next year.

I believe you can sign up for 1 or 2 days, and pay a reduced fee. The one problem I see with your plan is that they do give everyone a rider tag that you need to display on your bike(or person), so you come into their camp without that, and try to set up to camp, you might be questioned about that by someone with DNR and they may ask you to leave. They often camp at schools or other non designated camp sites, and I presume they(DNR) pays for this, so just camping with the tour group w/o paying is not a good plan. However, I don't see anything wrong with simply riding the trail and camping or lodging elsewhere on a schedule that coincides with the tour to get a feel for what it is like.

PS, FYI, the tour this year is June 16-20, and it starts in St. Charles(not official yet, but last year started in Clinton), but they have not announced the intermediate stops yet, but that should be avaliable in a few weeks.

am planning a trip for mid April 2008 to ride the trail from the Kansas City MO side (Clinton) to St Louis MO (St Charles). We would like to rent bikes in or near to Clinton and return them in or near to St Charles or St Louis. Are you aware of any way this can be accomplished? I see that some one way riders take the train and return by bike, we would like to avoid the need to add this extra step if we can. We only will have 4 days to ride and epect that the train will kill most of one day only giving us three (3) to ride, which might be a bit aggressive, your thoughts on this?

That's a good question. I am not aware of any bike rentals that can be picked up at one end of the trail and left at the other end. Most of the bike rentals are small independent bike shops, not affiliated with other shops at other points on the trail. You might want to call a few of the rental places on either end of the trail to see if they have any ideas.

One possibility is to get a shuttle service to haul the bikes back for you They typically haul bikes and riders, but I would imagine they'd be happy to do just bikes. But you may end up paying two or three hundred dollars to have the bikes transported cross-state. I would suggest calling a few shuttle services to check prices and feasibility.

You are correct that the train would require a day of your time. What's more, the trains frequently get behind schedule. It's a nice way to travel, but not when you're pressed for time.

As far as whether three days is reasonable for doing the whole trail: that's a pretty fast schedule, but many people do it in three days. It just depends on whether you're in condition to ride three consecutive 75-mile days.


Perhaps others will have ideas - I am posting your question and my answer on the Katy Trail Forum just in case someone out there has other suggestions.

Good luck, I hope it works out for you!

Shiping bikes back to Clinton of Sedalia would be much cheaper than shuttling them.

It seems this issue comes up from time to time.....how do I or my things get to the other end of the state now? Its a shame someone out there that wants to ride the trail can't share the rental expense and enjoy a one way ride back to the west side for you.

A friend and I stayed in the Katy View on June 10, 2007. Loved it! Enjoyed the quiet and the

opportunity to clean our clothes while taking a relaxing dip in the hot tub. Already trying to

find another time to go for a bike ride and stay at the B&B.... The host works at the Trailside

Cafe which is great inexpensive lunch also.

A friend and I stayed in the Katy View on June 10, 2007. Loved it! Enjoyed the quiet and the

opportunity to clean our clothes while taking a relaxing dip in the hot tub. Already trying to

find another time to go for a bike ride and stay at the B&B.... The host works at the Trailside

Cafe which is great inexpensive lunch also.

We stayed here on Aug 12 and loved it. The place is sort of a combo B&B/hostel because you have used of the kitchen, and there is no host on premise. Due to the heat, a grab and go breakfast was great. We were out and on the trail by 6:30, no need to wait to eat. The hot tub was dirty, but in 103 degree heat, we didn't want to use it anyway. We will tell the owner, she may not know. We would definitely recommend this place. Very convenient to the trail! Also, not the "doily" type of B&B. Very nice and clean.

We stayed here on Aug 12 and loved it. The place is sort of a combo B&B/hostel because you have used of the kitchen, and there is no host on premise. Due to the heat, a grab and go breakfast was great. We were out and on the trail by 6:30, no need to wait to eat. The hot tub was dirty, but in 103 degree heat, we didn't want to use it anyway. We will tell the owner, she may not know. We would definitely recommend this place. Very convenient to the trail! Also, not the "doily" type of B&B. Very nice and clean.

A rather odd place. Certainly not a typical bed & breakfast with a friendly host and homemade breakfasts. Not quite a hostel either. The living space was nice enough and the food provided for breakfast was tolerable. Yet, the entry code we were given for getting into the building was wrong (two too many digits) and had to depend on another lodger for the right code combination. Turns out, that lodger had to ask the manager for the correct code to get in. The hot tub actually smelled like stagnant pond water, so we chose to not use it. The manager did show up twice while we were there, but never said "hi" or in any way acknowledged our existence. The price is not terrible for what is a prime getaway town for Kansas City with other award-winning lodging, but it could easily be better than it is.

A rather odd place. Certainly not a typical bed & breakfast with a friendly host and homemade breakfasts. Not quite a hostel either. The living space was nice enough and the food provided for breakfast was tolerable. Yet, the entry code we were given for getting into the building was wrong (two too many digits) and had to depend on another lodger for the right code combination. Turns out, that lodger had to ask the manager for the correct code to get in. The hot tub actually smelled like stagnant pond water, so we chose to not use it. The manager did show up twice while we were there, but never said "hi" or in any way acknowledged our existence. The price is not terrible for what is a prime getaway town for Kansas City with other award-winning lodging, but it could easily be better than it is.

Just a quick note on the hot tub from the innkeepers of the Katy Trail B&B. During the 2007 season, we were frustrated too. The city of Rocheport switched from well water to county water. During the summer, we were faced with intermittent water quality issues that magnified themselves when filling a 500-gallon hot tub. They were blasting different levels of chlorine through the pipes that was working loose sediment in the old lines, and we were faced with extraordinary challenges to keep the hot tub in tip top shape, especially given the heavy use it receives on some weekends. The 2008 season and beyond should be cake compared to what we were dealing with last year. We've installed additional filtration and are changing our maintenance schedule to keep the hot tub in great shape so that its ready to soak your sore muscles and get you ready for another day of riding on the trail.

Just a quick note on the hot tub from the innkeepers of the Katy Trail B&B. During the 2007 season, we were frustrated too. The city of Rocheport switched from well water to county water. During the summer, we were faced with intermittent water quality issues that magnified themselves when filling a 500-gallon hot tub. They were blasting different levels of chlorine through the pipes that was working loose sediment in the old lines, and we were faced with extraordinary challenges to keep the hot tub in tip top shape, especially given the heavy use it receives on some weekends. The 2008 season and beyond should be cake compared to what we were dealing with last year. We've installed additional filtration and are changing our maintenance schedule to keep the hot tub in great shape so that its ready to soak your sore muscles and get you ready for another day of riding on the trail.

Regarding the breakfast, we have a very hearty continental breakfast that includes juice, coffee, tea, muffins, yogurt, granola, granola bars, fresh fruit, scones, cereal, oatmeal, bagels and toppings, etc. We find that what we are offering for the price is a perfect fit for the majority of our guests, who like the ability to come and go, and to eat and check out at their convenience. My wife Tawnee & I look forward to hosting you on your next Rocheport adventure.

Regarding the breakfast, we have a very hearty continental breakfast that includes juice, coffee, tea, muffins, yogurt, granola, granola bars, fresh fruit, scones, cereal, oatmeal, bagels and toppings, etc. We find that what we are offering for the price is a perfect fit for the majority of our guests, who like the ability to come and go, and to eat and check out at their convenience. My wife Tawnee & I look forward to hosting you on your next Rocheport adventure.

Regarding the keypad dilemma mentioned above. We're very sorry about that. Our first attempt at using keypads turned sour when the products we purchased proved to be pieces of junk (Ebay!) and required replacement after three weeks. This did create an awkward 1-week period where some guests arrived with a six digit keycode (for the old locks) that would not work for the new keypads (4 digits). We did have copious notes on the doors, etc., that explained how to convert the old codes to the new one, by omitting certain digits. Also, we had alerted everyone we could via email. With two phone numbers posted on the doors, etc., this is the only complaint we received while switching over to new equipment. We are sorry that caused you any inconvenience.

Regarding the keypad dilemma mentioned above. We're very sorry about that. Our first attempt at using keypads turned sour when the products we purchased proved to be pieces of junk (Ebay!) and required replacement after three weeks. This did create an awkward 1-week period where some guests arrived with a six digit keycode (for the old locks) that would not work for the new keypads (4 digits). We did have copious notes on the doors, etc., that explained how to convert the old codes to the new one, by omitting certain digits. Also, we had alerted everyone we could via email. With two phone numbers posted on the doors, etc., this is the only complaint we received while switching over to new equipment. We are sorry that caused you any inconvenience.

I'm searching for the full name and history of the N. FS. & N.W. railroad through the Oklahoma panhandle. The railroad was later taken over by MKT.

I could find references to W FS & NW (full name "unknown")that was taken over by the MKT at:

http://www.rootsweb.com/~okgenweb/okprojects/xref/railroads.html

but not N FS & NW. I caught a glimpse of the former on an image of an 1915 OK map but the page would not stay up. Indeed it appeared to be in the panhandle. As you are probably aware, the FS & NW would most likely be Fort Smith and Northwestern. See list of defunct railroads at:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_defunct_United_States_railroads

If it is a "W" and not a "N" then railroad names that include Fort Smith that I have seen include Wichita, Winfield and Wellington. If it is truly N FS & NW then I came up empty on that one.

If you haven't already done so consider contacting this KATY history reference:

http://www.railserve.com/jump/jump.cgi?ID=6147

Good luck!

Mr Baker, if you are still out there, here is a repost of the 1915 map. Allow a few seconds and a zoom button should appear on the bottom right corner.



http://www.rootsweb.com/~okgenweb/okprojects/xref/map/ok-west.jpg

The MKT took over the Wichita Falls & Northwestern in 1922. No doubt this is the railroad in the original question. This line went from Wichita Falls, Texas, to Forgan, Oklahoma. In 1929, the MKT purchased a second panhandle shortline, the Beaver, Meade & Englewood.



There is an excellent book, the last word really, about the two lines. Katy Northwest, The Story of a Branch Line Railroad, by Donovan Hofsommer was published in 1976.

I bought a great book on this subject last time I was in St. Louis at the book store at the Arch.

I will look around and see if I can find it. It was fascinating to read about the politics and all

that went into the making of the MKT. I am sure this topic was covered. If I can put my

hands on the book, I will post the information.

In 1931 the MKT bought the Beaver, Meade and Englewood Railroad (B.M. @E) a 105 mile extension from Frogan, OK, the Katy's Northwestern District. Source: The Katy Railroad and the Last Frontier by V. V. MAasterson.

I read an excellent book entitled "The KATY Railroad and the Last Frontier." It was ALL about the MK&T. It was available at my local library. Good luck!

My dad Louis Hiatt work on M.K.T. railroad in 1945 and 46 My dad and I got our picture and story in the Forgan Ok. newspaper because I was name after the M.K.T Railroad.My middle name is Kay.

From MO DNR:

The trail at MM 172.7 (west of Huntsdale) is temporarily closed to allow re-decking of the Terrapin Creek Bridge. Detour: To get from Rocheport to Huntsdale -- From the depot on First St., turn right on Pike St. and then right on Route BB, heading toward I-70. After crossing I-70, the road becomes Roby Farm Rd. (gravel). Turn right on Route O and continue to Huntsdale to get on the trail near Katfish Katys.

Ray, how long will this last, do you know? We are planning to ride from Columbia to Rocheport on Friday.

I don't know, but will try to find out - stay tuned...

It was originally scheduled for completion by today (2/25), but has been delayed by the weather. If the weather cooperates this week (which is questionable), it should be done by the weekend. But again, that's not a sure thing.



My suggestion is to call the Dept of Natural Resources throughout the week, to check on the status. Their number is 800-334-6946 - you'll have to navigate through some prompts but will eventually get to an option where you can speak to a real person to ask about the current situation.



Good luck!

Looks like they finished!

For cycling information in the midwest area the following is a good resource, although not well named. The Kansas Cyclist would be better named the Midwest Cyclist as it includes riding events, rails-to-trails, bike clubs, bike shops, bike news, for the states of Arkansas, Colorado, Iowa, Missouri, Nebraska, and Oklahoma.



http://www.kansascyclist.com/



I find this side usefull and thought other Katy types might also.

Thanks for the link. I live in KCMO. Half of these are in my back yard and I didn't even know about them..