Katy Trail Forum

I am planning to hike the trail from Clinton & ending in St. Charles this March. I am a ultra runner from Colorado but I used to live in Alton Illinois and this trail has always interest me. My plan is to hike/run the trail in 5 days or less. Can anyone give me advise on weather in March? I will be starting early every morning at around 4 - 5 am. I am one day looking at hiking the Colorado Trail so this will be a great training hike for that. I am also wanting to buy a book of the Katy Trail because my father will be following me on the trail setting up camp every 50 miles or so. Thanks for the info,
Stephen!

From the home page on this site, scroll down for both guidebook and MO weather info. March can be pretty cold and wet.

That sounds like an ambitious plan, but it also sounds like you are in shape. Keep in mind that you really can't see beyond "civil twilight", which is about 30 minutes before sunrise and 30 minutes after sunset. Also keep in mind that Daylight Saving Time starts on March 11. So without a flashlight, you can't hike safely before 6 a.m. early in the month, and 7 a.m. after March 12. But once you start, you will have 12 hours of hiking at that time of year. Good luck.

Yeah I hike/run a lot during the night with a headlamp to get my training in and still spend time with family! I have run a lot of 100 mile runs but not thru hikes so itd will be a great challenge!

If you go to weather.com, click on monthly, then click on averages, you can get a basic idea of seaonal weather changes for any given area.

Good luck. Remember, though, that the park is only open during daylight hours.

I intended to run/hike it in 6 days last May. I had run a few 100 mile weeks in preparation, and was in pretty good shape. The thing I was not prepared for is how flat the Katy Trail is. I went east-west, and in the first 160 miles there was 150 ft of climb, almost a foot a mile! It was the same step over and over with no variance. After 2 days (85 miles) I ended up with severe tibial tendonitis and could hardly take a step. I didn't finish the trail on foot but ended up renting a bicycle and still had a good time.

Good advice, im sure the unchange in footing is very rough on ones body. I am doing lots of my training on rock paths similar to Katy Trail! I have done few 50 mile hikes on this this trail and you can for sure feel it. All I can do is train and do what I can. Did you hike or run the trail? I am thinking 15 min miles just a fast hike!

Best wishes with your adventure. Keep us posted over the next few months. I am interested in following the story. (As a side note, I am headed to Castle Rock in June for the Elephant Rock Cycling Classic.) Again - best wishes.

I did a run/walk, averaging about 12 minute miles for a moving pace. With a couple of hours of break for lunch and exploring the towns along the way, the overall average was about 15:00/mile.

To carry the discussion a step further do you think that a regular road bike with 27"/1" would work for the entire length of the Katy Trail?

I wouldn't do it. Recommend a hybird with 32's.

If you ride in the lane where most of the pug has been kicked to the side, you should do fine. We ride 28's on the tandem and have done fine. We've also ridden hybrids with wider tires, but when you find yourself in the loose stuff it doesn't seem to matter what the tire size is.

I'd recommend going with a good puncture-resistant tire. A little wider is good because you'll run into washouts and other gnarly trail and something with a little width and tread (and a little lower pressure) absorbs the shock better.

The only time I've had a flat on the trail was when I was using slicks instead of something with a little tread on them.

Thanks all! Your comments are most helpful! Take care and have a great weekend!

We ride road bikes with 27's on the Katy on a regular basis. Wider tires make life easier and may reduce flats, but will also slow you down. It depends on your budget and goals.

I did the entire trail on 27 x 1-1/4 touring tires. Nothing special, just $20 tires and regular tubes. Maybe I was a little lucky, but did not suffer any punctures or flats.

I ride the Treloar to Machens section on 27x 1 1/8 without any problems. (Actually, I replaced my worn out tires with 27x 1 1/4 this year, but I can't really feel any difference.) The 27x1 would pretty much be like a 700Cx25mm, and that's been used by a bunch of people.
As another person commented, and depending upon your total weight of bike and rider, you might want to use a larger volume tire that would allow you to run lower pressure.

I have rode the trail from Columbia MO to St. Charles and back twice, and both times I have used a road bike with no problems. One of the trips was slightly soggy and I still encountered no problems. That said, St. Charles to Machens trail packing was a bit loose and would be rough on a road frame. It should be noted that i am in my mid 20s so a little roughness wasnt too bad.

Sort of an update comment regarding the previous poster's comment: I rode the St. Charles to Machens section yesterday, 8/29/2011, and it was packed okay for my 1985 chrome-moly frame road bike with 27 x 1 1/4 tires. Only a fairly short section just NE of St. Charles is a bit new. This section is a little curvy with some small ups and downs. It's rougher than average, but still okay for a metal road bike. (I suppose you could use a carbon frame. But he original poster was asking about 27 inch tires, so that wouldn't apply.)

The tire diameter isn't the issue. I ride it with a 26 inch rear and 20 inch front (long wheel based recumbent) and it rides great on this trail. The issue is width because it's crushed limestone/dirt...well packed mind you, most of the time. I use 1 1/4" with no problem on this type trail. I've never had a flat on the trail, but a riding buddy once picked up 4 thorns in one place on his MTB 2 1/4 width tires (crossing the river at Boone).

I have rode various recumbents since the trail opened. I've had four flats that I can remember. Taking spare inner tubes and the tools to change them has always been what saves me.

Unless you are riding after a SIGNIFICANT period of rain - I think you will be fine. Good advise to stay away from the loose stuff on the edges. Puncture resistant is more important to me than width. That said - my preferred width is 28s.

My 2 cents worth on this is that you CAN ride almost anything you want to, but you WANT to ride something a little wider and softer. Depending on what kind of bike you have, I prefer 700c x 37's or 26" x 1.5 path tires with a fairly smooth tread (but not slick), both with 60 or 65 lbs. of air of pressure. Specialized makes a tire called the Nimbus: It is perfect in my opinion because it has a light tread with no where for the little limestone arrowheads to imbed in the tire, nor do they throw up a lot of dirt for the riders behind you, or on you. Sure the path is hard, but in most places it feels as if Kitty Litter was spread on top of it. There are lots of spots that have been washed out, there are ruts, there are bumpy surfaces left by the lugs on tractors and maintence vehicles, etc. There are also LOTS of dirt roads that cross the trail, and every time that happens, there is a rough transition from the path surface over the dirt road and then back on to the path. The loose surface also makes it tough to go real fast: I am a road rider and usually ride in the 15-18mph range: On our thru trip last fall, we usually went 12-13 mph when loaded with 25-30lb of gear-. The surface also gets pretty loose when it's wet. All that to say, I think you can ride anything, but you take your chances if you go skinny, it would be pretty rough, and I strongly recommend that you go big with less air pressure and puncture protection from all those little limestone arrohead shards.

The city park has camping,$15.00 a tent, with Shower. Lots of traffic/truck noise, located by hwy 100.

Which city park KW? Hwy 100 is not on the Katy Trail.

The park is at the corner of 14th and Market.
More exact is Mozart St. and Gasconade St. This is not a bad camp ground for being in the middle of town. There is a bit of traffic noise. Last time I was there they were just starting the new bridge

Are you referring to the City Park of Hermann?

The hours have changed. Sun-Mon 9am-3pn, Tues-Wed, 7am-3pm, Thurs-Sat 7am-6pm

I have grown up in St. Charles where the old men played "up and down broadway" in the Pine room bar, through all the growth and all the changes; Tuners, is one of those bars that have stood the test of time. You can't ask for friendlier people than owners, Susie and Jim.
A Good burger at lunch and at night the music is some of the best you'll experience in St.Charles...If you like blues, rock and roll, newer rock and the ever-famous "BLACKDOG." and rubbing shoulders with us ole-timers this is a good time. Bachelorette parties always welcome! Say hello to Jr. at the door...

So far in the last 6 months we've done the Creeper Trail, the New River Trail, The Great Alleghany Passage, the Greenbriar, the Silver Comet, and the Chief Ladiga---on all these trails we have hammocked along the way.
So for those who've actually ridden the Katy what is the potential for hammocking?
Hammocking does not necessarily imply 'stealth' camping-I've even hung between telephone pole and its guy wire in an established campground before.
Our group size is growing daily and we will either do this ride in late April or first of June and we have a potential group size of 12-15 riders, ALL who use hammocks!
What I normally do is use Google maps and scour the intended riding zone for national forests or any area with lots of trees.
So in a general way do previous riders remember large areas of trees along the way--yes even private land owners often will let us 'hang' for money!
Any clues muchly appreciated!

what's the weight and do you have rain protection?

Good timing! When we returned from a ride yesterday we saw someone in a hammock at the JC trailhead. He was suspended between two of the braces on the trailhead shelter.

Don't want to highjack your question or the discussion, but VERY curious as to your experiences and any information/opinions you would like to share about the other trails that you mention. I have the chance to ride 50-100 mile rides on the KATY several times a year and am looking for other adventures. C&O/Allegheny is on my list for 2012, but again, always interested in feedback/experiences of others. Thanks.

Hammocked our way through in June. Between two trees in city park Green Ridge, with at Round House campground. The supports in the park shelter in Marthasville are perfect width. But too many people in your group for the places we went - even the Campground didn't have that many places ! Doubt that you will want to venture out to non-established spot because most of the land adjacent to the trail is low and/or swamp. Remember you are following the river!

howardhughesblues----
the weight of my hammock? Its a Warbonnet Blackbird so around 17 ounces
the weight of my bike? Fargo in Ti, 23 pounds 8 ounces
the weight of me? !! HA! well 3 months ago I was 204, now I'm 189---thanks to biking a lot and eating veggies veggies veggies
Rain protection? For the hammock...Yes I carry a separate fly. It is in cuben fiber, made by hammockgear dot com. It weights 5.6 ounces.
Rain protection for me? Yes, I actually use a Packa made also in cuben fiber and about the same weight as my tarp...it has a long tail making it suitable for biking.

Anonymous-- questions about the other trails...just ask and I'll spill the beans!
I will say my favorite overall so far was the Greenbriar; you really feel remote--NO cell service for 80 miles! The Gov. shuts down all radio in the area--a huge monitoring tower is there, some kind of listening post. The campsites on the Greenbriar were abs. perfect-always by the water, set up with a shelter (kinda like the ones on the Appalachian Trail), water pumps and the river close by. When we did the Greenbriar we saw only 6 other cyclists during the 3 day ride.
For lots of info you can go to youtube and search for MedicineMan4040. I make vids of my trips and you can gleen some info there....and/or ask here :)
Dbk-- perfect response! So it is possible. I've hung my hammock over water (Everglades NP) before so swampy is a non issue. Our current committed size is 5 riders but that is growing almost weekly. Hammockers are used to dispering and being creative....but did anyone notice any large or I should say LARGE tracks of treed land?
On trips like this I've learned to carry a tent too. Just picked up a cuben tent, double wall that weighs 17 ounces; it however uses hiking poles so a work around on that will be needed.
Thanks again everybody for all the responses.

MedicineMan, Click on the trip planner link abouve and select camping. That will show you a couple of Conservation Areas near Rocheport and Hartsburg that allow camping. The camping area in Klondike Park near Augusta is pretty wooded also.

MedicineMan, Its not legal to camp along the trail but with some planning you should'nt have much of a problem finding a campground. It may spread your group out a little finding adequate trees/poles to hang from.

I've riden all the trails you listed except the Greenbriar and also would like more info on that trail. Enjoy the Katy ! Its best rail in the US because of many reasons. Its well maintained, frequent food & lodging, nice scenery, the use of Amtrak, and most of all the people of MO are super friendly and helpful.

Paulie

More awesome responses!
OK considering what has been suggested that leaves the area of Rhineland/Herman/Bluffton for 'hanging' sites and also on the other end Sedalia and Greenbridge!
Speaking of Sedalia, if right in my thinking Amtrak runs there....now how would one get to the actual trail terminus in Clinton?

OK, the Greenbriar. Since you've done the Alleghany Passage you know that if leaving Maryland (which we did) you'll have a 21 mile climb to the highest point. Like most RTTs (rails to trails) it's gradual but still uphill and with camping kit on the bike for us--needless to say slept well that night making it to a stealth hanging spot about 2 miles shy of the top (we didn't get started until 5ish.....There are NO such climbs on the Greenbriar. Comparing and contrasting; on the GAP you'll find many many little towns for food/lodging/repair...on the Greenbriar I only recall one town in the middle (nice bike/coffee shop run by a former distance cyclist/racer) ~she even had a 29 inch tube~. As mentioned in the previous post to ME the Greenbriar was just simply beautiful in scenary and in tread=what my ties actually ride on. Oh, I did say that the Greenbriar has shelters as well as campsites/fire rings/horse tethers (for lack of the real term) BUT that was only in one county (the trail is contained in two counties)...the other county I suppose voted no shelters.
Our challenge on the Greenbriar was keeping our nerve with the shuttle driver--kinda good ol boy types in a huge crew cab pickup. They actually work for the ski slopes in the area and shuttle for extra sheckles...no racks just toss the bikes in the back and pray (silently)...a long shuttle too.
We also had shuttle problems in not being able to find one for the Silver Comet/Chief Ladiga---so just drove two cars down and self shuttled.
LUCK-so far we've ridden 480ish miles since May and not a drop of rain. I bet we won't be so lucky in 5 days of riding the Katy!

Off Topic...I loved the C&O and GAP (including a side trip to Falling Water, a dream come true!).

Hey Medicaneman, I really enjoyed your utube channel. Makes me want to join your group when you ride the Katy. I'm WAY overdue for a Katy fix. I've been to many of the same places in your videos, brought back some good memories. Also I liked you hammock/tarp system. Good way to stay dry on a raining night. Thanks for sharing and happy trails,

Paulie

Just fyi, a ranger at Klondike told me that hammocks are not permitted there.

Thanks for the positives on my feeble youtube attempts!
OK, mental note-no hammocking at Klondike.
Yes Fallingwater is a dream-but NO photography allowed inside.
This past weekend we lived out of kayaks on Lake Marion--a great experience BUT while down there studied the Palmetto Trail for a near future ride when its nothing but snow and ice here. Thinking first of December and wetting our Palmetto appetites by doing the 47 miles 'passage' in the Francis Marion Nat.Forest.
Since I last posted my Fargo has lost some more weight and is down to 22.78 pounds-not bad for a 29er...if I could just divorced myself from the Brooks saddle I could save more :(
If/when we do the Palmetto let me know if you want feedback since this is a Katy Trail forum.

It may be too cold to wet your appetite in December.

read your article so you have also riddent the creeper trail. i got the chance to ride it once. absolutely loved it. had 3 flats from whitetop to damascus. had to walk the last 3 miles. well worth it though. had a blast. good luck on your ride. sounds like fun.

Festus- at least those last 3 miles are flat! The Creeper Trail is visually the most stunning of all the rail-trails I've done; alas it is very close to me and we take it for granted.
For those interested know that this can be a free roll ride in that there are many bicycle shuttlers in Damascus who will take you to White Top (second highest peak in Virginia) and you literally roll down crossing many high trestles (worthy in their own right for inspection). Outside of Damascus you will also be rolling/riding on the Appalachian Trail for a short period-both these trails share common footpath/bike path for a while. If interested in the Appalachian Trail (I've completed 1716 miles of it), Damascus is home to the annual Trail Days so many venues could be had in one trip.
Sorry about your flats!

no problem on the flats. stuff happens. had some cheap tubes in the tires. put thicker tubes in there. no problems since. we stayed in damascus when i rode the trail. beautiful town. actually walked part of the appalachian trail southbound for a mile or so out of town, and again when it met the creeper trail. hope to hike the entire appalachian trail before i die. do the entire katy also.

The Katy is getting closer and closer. I've been active lately but mostly backpacking in Great Smoky Mtn NP and in the Big South Fork but I'm getting in my 2-3 bike rides each week...that will change quickly once real winter gets here and I hate trainers!
One of the women going with us is now up to 18miles/day on a typical road bike so by late spring she should have no problem.
On the camping/hammocking plans we've decided to carry hammocks for when we can and carry VISA for the times we cannot!
I've been to Pompey's Pillar out west and jumped on the Katy opportunity because of Lewis and Clarke....if any here are fans of the Expedition and know of spots along the Katy that a huge admirer of the Lewis and Clarke team should not miss please let me know.

You didn't mention with your list of trails the Cowboy Trail in Nebraska. (www.bikecowboytrail.com) Not used much but a good trail. Doesn't have the amenities that the Katy does. You have to ride the middle of the trail and try to avoid the "Texas goathead sandbur." I got one in my Burley trailer tire. You could probably hammock there several places.

MedicineMan, be sure to see the statues and tribute to Lewis & Clarke at the NE corner of the capitol in Jeff City. There are also several/many comemorative plaques along the trail with info on their expedition.

Attn: Medicine Man. Missouri has alot of Lewis and Clark spots. In 2004 my wife conducted a L & c festival in Hartsburg and had many reenactors here. Fort Osage near KC is a replica of a fort Clark helped build after the expedition returned home. In St Charles there is a Lewis and Clark Corps of Discovery that created the three boats of L & C expedition and they followed the trip the entire way to the Pacific. Hartsburg has a large rock that Clark mentioned in his journels and York gathered watercress near here. Jefferson City has the best statues we have seen, just east of the Missouri capital. Welcome to L & C country.

Fantastic replies! Thanks! All serve to fuel the anticipation between now and the beginning of the ride.
My last L/C experience was making it to Fort Klatsop for the 200th aniversay....I think biking in their footsteps will be even better :)

Weather is going to be rather nice for this time of the year, We are going to ride to Hartsburg from North Jefferson leaving around 1:30 if anyone cares to join us should be back by 4:30

Wow. Wish I lived closer, I would be there in hurry. Just thinking about how nice it would be to take a cruise on the KATY today. Enjoy!