Katy Trail Forum

This needs to b e paved; then you have a real national treasure. Cant we start a go fund me? any type of donation system? Even a dollar from everyone who rides it would help. Donors would get together to pave sections for naming rights along the trail. There can be events to fund the paving. Its nice; its shaded, but its dirty.

It looks like it will be paved after you with your knowledge of national treasure funding takes action. I can’t believe no one has thought of this yet! For perspective, what is the cost for a donor to pave a section? And what is a reasonable distance to be called a section? What are the logistics of paving, ie start at one end and pave continuously to the other end? Or let donors have whatever section they want paved leaving non paved sections dotted along until someone wants to pay for those?

Please share your knowledge and let us know the details!

That would be great if it was paved, but it will never happen. The costs to pave are incredibly high and the costs to maintain and repair are prohibitively high. The parks budget is already tight and underfunded for a park that stretches 237 miles. The Missouri River regularly damages the trail and the surrounding property. The equipment brought onto the trail for repairs would cause further damage and wear/tear because the trail would be paved thick enough for bikes and light vehicles, not trucks and equipment. Consider this: Lee’s Summit, Missouri is a wealthy suburb of Kansas City. They have a portion of the Rock Island trail (and parts of the Rock Island are included in the Katy Trail State Park.) Even the wealthy city with multiple funding sources didn’t pave their complete trail…..although a few parts of it are paved . Like I said, it would be great paved…..a few long trail systems in the country are paved such as the Trail of the Coeur d’Alene.

I think the Chat is part of the Beauty of this Trail. It keeps it "Country". Katy is not really a Race Track to Hurry Down! It is suppose to be more Scenic, more Rural, more Relaxing. ;-)
Also, keep in mind, when the pavement needs fixing, and it would, what a mess and dangerous road it would be.

Forget to add......this Planet has enough Pavement, don't you think?
Asphalt is also cheap.....AND HOT! And very slick when wet.
To me? It is 'Be careful what you ask for.'

Ditto what Marna said. While there are a lot of beautiful paved trails out there, I love the Katy the way she is.

I've ridden rail-trails all across the country. My least favorites are the ones that are paved. The pavement deteriorates very quickly and becomes far less pleasant and far less safe. Gravel is best! I don't think there is any danger that paving the KATY will ever happen and, for that, we should all be glad. We have lots of pavement for people to ride if you prefer pavement.

As others have said, paving the Katy would be extremely expensive as would be future repairs. What you need for the Katy is the proper bike and tires. I've found 700x32 tires great on both a hybrid and touring bike. My wife and I have 26x2.125" tires on a tandem and that works very well also. As far as dirt, fenders help a lot especially if the trail is wet.

Earlier this year we rode both the Great Allegheny Passage (GAP) and C&O Towpath from Pittsburgh to DC. The GAP had a similar surface as the Katy and great riding. The C&O however was dirt and mud more than half the time. Crushed limestone would be a major improvement.

I understand asking for pavement, but long term it becomes a maintenance issue. Not to mention a million speedbumps where roots pop up the pavement. Love it for what it is, rather than despising it for what it isn't.

Well drats James Davis from St Louis. Doesn't look like of the six others that replied, any are too interested in putting up any money for the cause. Yet anyway.

Hopefully when you share the details of your plan it will open a few eyes and donors will be gained.

---Sitting in the shade waiting---

If only someone would raise the funds to pave it...
and then spend that money fixing the bridge between Rocheport and New Franklin.

I road a portion of the Raccoon River Trail in Iowa, it was nice new concrete trial coming out of Perry Iowa, then turns north towards Jefferson Iowa and was cheap blacktop with cracks running across the width of the trail every 10 to 15 feet. Thud-thump, thud-thump, thud-thump… I’m guessing people within a mile heard my curses as I hit each bump.

So I vote no on pavement. ;-/

Paved trails are nice. Usually we find them in population centers so I would expect them to start working out from Kansas City and St. Charles since they get the high population. Trails in the hinterland tend to be crushed stone. The Ohio to Erie as paved except for the Cuyahoga National Park section which was more single track like the C&O. Both the Ohio to Erie and the Erie Canal still have portions on roads.

I know here in Ohio most of the paving is done by local/county governments using state and federal grants with local fundraising so we end up with sections that are paved and then not and overtime the nots get filled in. Over time is years/decades.

Let me reiterate Gary's concerns about the fate of some paved trails. I rode a variety of trails in Colorado this summer, with many of them paved. Some trails were just fine, if they were concrete/cement and/or new. A few trails were blacktop, and the older ones suffered the major problem of cracks every so often (10-30 feet). The cracks really made for an uncomfortable ride. Fixing all those cracks would greatly increase the long-term price for such a paved surface.

Madison County Transit is a great example of how long a paved trail can last (if it is done correctly) ; pretty much forever. It has been 20 years now and it still in great condition and smooth and clean. It is easier to maintain and would be safer too. The Katy Trail needs to be paved. It is a shame that it is not. It is also sad that it is not. There are MANY ways to EASILY fund this. We can do this!!! It will bring even more people; to spend even more money, in the state, like I did; even more often. The River Des Pere trail is still here and in great condition. I can start giving right now with the first dollar. If everyone who has ever rode the trail would do the same, we can pave the trail.

Just a simple NO to paving an absolutely beautiful trail.

Love it the way it is, paving would be a terrible idea. Too expensive, too much maintenance, and riding crushed rock is a better riding experience anyways.

Please please please do not pave the trails ???????????? Keep them peaceful, pleasant, and beautiful. They are already a treasure. Pavement ruins so much. Then who’s going to keep up with ripples, potholes, etc. It’s so beautiful, nice, and rural like it is. The hordes have so many other paved places to ride. This is a Beautiful country ride. TYIA.

I live near the Madison County trails. I don’t ride them because they are paved. I love the Katy trail just as it is. I put 1000 to 2000 miles on it every year. If you have ever ridden the paved trail from Aton to Grafton you see what happens to an asphalt trail in close proximity to trees and their roots. Paving the trail with the impact the trees, rock slides and flooding would be unsustainable.

The MCT paved trails are great. But you can't compare their condition after years of use to the Katy. All of the maintenance issues with the trail east of Booneville are from flooding in the Missouri river and its tributaries. That's not an issue for Madison County. 2" of asphalt isn't going to resist the waters of the Missouri river any better than crushed limestone. It would just be more expensive to maintain. The bridge west of Rocheport would still be gone. The GAP trail in PA is crushed limestone and it is in wonderful condition. I didn't see a washout or recent repair along its entire length. The difference is that where it follows a river it is high enough to not get flooded. Mo State Parks has a tremendous backlog of deferred maintenance items in all of its parks. If someone donated the entire cost of paving the Katy there would not be enough money to maintain it in the current political environment in Missouri.

In short, the answer to your question is never. At least until attitudes change about the public benefit of increasing tax revenues in the state.

FWIW, the current crushed limestone trail is fine. There are plenty of places to ride for those who insist on pavement. I think many people are unnecessarily fearful of riding on the roads. With good route planning, highly visible clothing and lighting lots of people ride thousands of miles on the road and live to tell the tale.

One of the comments mentions "riding on roads" if you want to ride on pavement. Sorry, you can wear all the safety clothing and gear you want, but all it takes is one careless driver and you are (at best) in a wheelchair for the rest of your life. At worst, well, you know. I've not for paving the Katy, but I love life too much to entrust it to crazy drivers on highways. And there are millions of crazy drivers out there every day. I do like the paved trails in Madison County, IL, but crushed limestone trails like the 109-mile George S. Mickelson rail-to-trail in South Dakota are wonderful too. But I wouldn't let a person I cared for ride on a highway for a million dollars.

Don't pave. Just rode the Silver Comet / Chief Lagota rails to trails that runs 100 miles between Atlanta and Anniston AL. The Ga. section is concrete and for the most part great. But AL. black top their section and tree roots make it a rough go.

Florida has hundreds if not thousands of miles of paved trails, the are well maintained. I lived there several years and enjoyed them. Tree roots did not seem to be a major problem. I have ridden the KATY and see no reason why it couldn't be paved. Rode bikers, skate boarders, scooters ect. would be able to enjoy it. That would mean more people and business. When the river floods you would simply clear off the debris and not have to haul in more rock over and over. There are also miles of paved trails in Nashville, Chattanooga and other places in the country.

Anna from golden
I have seen floods tear up a major highway near North Jefferson to the point that it looked like it was bombed, with slabs of concrete jutting up in the air so I’m am absolutely positive that flooding would not result in a simple cleaning afterwards.

I suspect the sandy soil and lack of freeze thaw cycles in winter limit tree root displacement of paved trails in Florida.

John H from Pacific MO:
I bet that you are right. I've seldom seen potholes in Florida.

Madison County Trails have a lot of tree roots in places. Heck the MetroBikeLink trail near Southern Illinois College has a sign telling cyclist to dismount over a tenth-mile section due to large bumps from tree roots in the asphalt.

I highly doubt its ever paved, nor in my opinion should it be. The cost would be astronomical and that doesn't include maintenance, which would be even higher than what it is now. Flooding, freeze/thaw and more would be a big problem. No, The Katy is fine as is and the state has enough problems keeping it up already. I ride the trail out of North Jefferson nearly every day and its a great trail as is.

Weighing in on this older topic after riding the trail. The trail is not really in that bad of shape but I can see that flooding/rain creates issues.

I think the fact that it is a state park makes it harder to pave. Many trails are paved by local groups or governments and in this case they would not be able to. I could see St. Charles paving their section for example or the section near Jeff City because of the higher density of users.

We noticed that in the west, many of the roads we crossed were not paved. It probably would be hard justifying paving a bike trail to residents when their roads are not paved.

I endorse 1000% Vicky, Russ, Janna and all the others who say NO TO PAVING. We've ridden the Katy and many others in the USA and the UK, and part of the beauty is the changing surface, the rough and the smooth, with a little bit of tarmac (blacktop) when you ride through a town or village. If you want flat and boring, go to the velodrome or ride on the road.

Go somewhere else if you want a paved easy trail. We love it like it is. Nissouri has so many other needs this should never come up.

I just finished a bikepacking trip on the Katy Trail. The food highlight of the trip was the KT Caboose in Marthasville. High quality vegetarian food (I had the falafel wrap), and topknotch coffee (french press). The owner Jonathan was delightful to talk to, and a group of us solo riders had a great conversation on the deck. Highly recommended!

I am looking for a definitive answer on whether the Corner Store in Chilhowee is still open. I can't through on the phone number and am getting conflicting information on the internet. Biking through there in a couple of weeks and would like to confirm.

I stopped earlier in the summer and they were open on a Saturday. Very reasonable prices.

Different owners and now Hometown Convenience Store. Open every day except Sunday I believe. Two blocks off the trail and great stop for cyclists.

The gap from the ground to the top of the wooden bridge coming from the Katy trail to the shop is dangerous. It needs to be fixed. One of your customers could get hurt if they fail to negotiate the jump up the gap to the bridge. It could result in a law suit if someone gets hurt.

Apparently you were there in person. Did you tell them at that time? I'm guessing not. Did you call, go to their Facebook page, etc? Seems like this forum would be an ineffective way to communicate to them.

They don't come to this group and will never see this.

If you're riding the Katy and needing a place to stay in Augusta, I highly recommend the Lindenhof Bed and Breakfast, which is just a couple blocks off the trail. Our group of six stayed there two nights last week, and the accommodations were absolutely perfect. Kathy was a gracious and informative host, and our rooms were spacious, clean, comfy, and charming. We shared the common area with two other guests, and there was plenty of space for all of us to relax. Our breakfast both days was delicious, with more than enough carbs and protein to fuel our morning rides. We also loved the outdoor space--lovely greenery everywhere, a shed to park our bikes, plenty of seating around the water feature and the fireplace (which we used both nights), and even a hot tub (which we didn't use but could have). We've stayed in a lot of places over the years while riding the Katy, but the Lindenhof B&B is now one of our favorites that I'm sure we'll return to in the future.

I was wondering if anyone has bike the trail in winter? I am currently in iraq but will be back mid nov and would love to bike the trail with some of my well deserved time off.

Has anyone did this? Any tips?



Thanks

KB - your time, efforts, and courage in Iraq are greatly appreciated. The tranquility of the Katy Trail may be just the ticket for you after your return.



The trail is open year-round, and can be great in the winter. There's more to see with the leaves off of the trees, and you'll just about have the trail to yourself.



The biggest thing to look out for, when riding between November and April, is to be able to get to all the services you need along the way (food, water, etc.). Some of the businesses that specifically cater to cyclists close for the winter or operate on shorter hours. Plan your route with this in mind, and maybe call a few of the stores or restaurants along your route to make sure they'll be open. Also, many of the trailhead restrooms on the western end of the trail are locked for the winter.



I try to keep up with winter closings on this website - the closed businesses will show up with "closed for the season" in red, in the various listings throughout the site.



Good luck, and enjoy your return to the states!

I rode the western end of the Katy in February 2006 and the trail was in great shape. If the winter is dry and mild, the trail should be rideable. The Katy tends to dry more quickly than limestone trails in other parts of the Midwest after it rains. The water and restrooms at some trailheads will be closed or shut down for the season. If the weather cooperates, you will have a great time riding. Thank you for serving in Iraq. I'm planning an early November trip to the Katy myself and plan on spending a week there.

kb, from independence.



sorry, cannot help you on the water situation at the trail heads during the winter, just saying thank you for serving our country and protecting our way of life. God bless you, come home safe, and have a great ride. i garantee you will truly enjoy the ride. you certainly have earned it. again , thank you !!!!!!

When do businesses along Katy Trail close for the season in general? We want to ride it the first week of November. Has anyone done that and found places to spend the night and eat? Thanks

If you call early enough, like early October we will still take a reservation for the first week of November. (573) 657-5428. Globe Hotel Bed and Breakfast.

I'd plot a course, and look for stops that don't seem seasonal, and then call them.

Casey's convenience stores will always be open. Some businesses may stay open just for hunting season. And some will close once the leaf/winery traffic dies down.

You'll want to carry enough food and water to last a couple of days in case things really go sideways. As sparse as resources can be in some stretches, it's not hard for me to imagine a couple of bad days in a row where the trailside amenities aren't open.

Besides that, winter ought to be a really nice, peaceful time to be out there.

My woolly worm forecast indicates a mild winter this year, so you got that going for you.

The trailheads with running water will be closed for the winter but the trailheads with good old outhouses will remain open, always carry toilet paper just in case.

My woolly worm forecast indicates a mild winter this year, so you got that going for you.

The trailheads with running water will be closed for the winter but the trailheads with good old outhouses will remain open, always carry toilet paper just in case.

The Bluffton Barn is open year round and you would be very welcome. I would suggest reservations though as that is the time of year I get to go hunting camping sitting around the fire playing music with friends. Of course, I do that all right here too.

Hi, my friend who is going to bike with me is interesting in doing the trail with a pedal assist (or ebike) bike. Do people have a recommendation on how/where to rent a pedal assist from Kansas City and then drop it off in St. Louis. We wouldn't need support during the trip, so this was just be getting the pedal assist bike in Kansas City and then leaving it in St. Louis.

Hmmm. How are you managing your bike? Doing a one way rental on any bike is pretty expensive, if possible at all.

At this point, we weren't sure if it was possible. I'll be bringing by hybrid bike, but by friend wanted to use a pedal assist or ebike. It sounds like is very difficult to fly with pedal assist or ebikes, so I had the idea of renting one one way.

Assuming you're flying into STL, I'd rent the ebike at the bike shop along the waterfront in St Charles.

Then either get a shuttle or take the train west, and then ride back.
Or, if you are starting in KC, a one way car rental from STL to KC might not be horrible.

I know car rentals have gotten a little nuts, but when we did the GAP, renting a car was just a few bucks more than taking Amtrak, and we didn't have to worry about all the Amtrak drama.

As others have commented, this is a great B & B & Kathy is a gracious host.
On a Wed night no restaurants open in Augusta. But right across the street is the Emporium....sandwiches, snacks, beer and more.
We bought fixings & had a picnic in the yard at the Lindenhof.

Kathy serves a yummy breakfast!

We rode the Katy Trail last week from Sedalia to St. Charles and had a great trip. Friends & acquaintances have said “I’m not sure I could do a ride like that.”
This post is for those who aren’t sure ...
My husband & I are both 73. I ride a hybrid; he has a gravel bike. Most days we ride about 12 miles on city streets. Earlier this summer we did a couple 40 mile rides on bike trails to be sure we could handle the distance.
If you can comfortably ride 40 miles and if you can change a tire, you can do a multi day trip on the Katy. Our longest day was 50 miles.
We did a self guided trip through Crossroads Tours & were very happy with their service. They shuttled us to Sedalia, reserved the hotels and moved our luggage.
For us, the luggage transport was money well spent. We only had to carry what we needed during the day.
We each had 2 water bottles, filled them at trailheads or trailside businesses & never ran out of water.
For our trip, the trail was in great shape. Washouts from earlier in the summer had been repaired.
If you have time for a layover day, Hermann is a great little town.

So, I'm just trying to over plan my trip here. If I should need a repair or a rescue between Rocheport and St. Charles, I've identified the following bike shops. Have I missed any? Also, the KT site lists one as "BP" at McKittrick. Is that a gas station that does bike repairs also?
Here's my list: Meriwether Cafe/Shop at Rocheport, Red Wheel and Cycle Depot in Jeff City, BP at McKittrick, Revolution Cycles in Washington, Kick Stand at Augusta, Katy Bike Rental at Defiance, and then at St. Charles, Bike Stop Cafe, Bike Stop Outpost, Touring Cyclist Shuttle. Any of these inactive, to your knowledge? Thanks.

I'm sorry, that was an error on the BP listing - I have corrected it. It's a regular gas station / convenience store with ATM.

Also be aware that Touring Cyclist is not actually in St Charles; they are in Bridgeton which is across the river and would be very hard to reach from the Katy Trail. It's a good bike shop, but listed here mainly for their shuttle service.

Other than that, I think your list is complete and accurate, but I welcome and appreciate any corrections or additions.

Good luck with your trip - happy trails!

It’s good to know the backup plan, but a bike in good working order can negate the need for every bike shop along the trail.

I doubt if it's needing EVERY bike shop along the trail as much as it's needing ONE and knowing where it is.

Just an FYI - Touring Cyclist does not do shuttle service. I called them yesterday.

Thanks for the heads-up on Touring Cyclist - I did not know they had gotten out of the shuttle business. I have removed them from that list.

Don’t miss Cycle Depot on West Main in Jeff City. Pam and Mark are great folks and Mark is a top
notch wheel and bike builder and bike mechanic. They are my go-
to place in Jeff City.


Sharon

I used this page plus the two Facebook groups to plan my trip, so I thought I would share my Facebook post here. If you plan to do the whole trail, do your homework. As the old saying goes, if you fail to plan, you plan to fail.
From my Facebook:
I just rode my bicycle across the entire state of Missouri, plus about 31 miles into Illinois crossing the Mississippi via a river ferry. Later going back across the Mississippi via the historic Old Chain of Rocks Bridge, ending my ride at the Gateway Arch and Busch Stadium. The Cardinals were about to play and it was a very fun environment. That atmosphere made me realize why some people want to see the Royals have a stadium downtown. This bike ride took six days and 394 miles, starting on Monday, Labor Day and concluding yesterday, the twentieth anniversary of the 9/11 attacks. Garmin does not have the ability to track multi-day rides, perhaps I can merge them later with an app. I rode all of the Rock Island trail and almost all of the Katy trail. The majority of the trip was gravel trail, some paved trail and perhaps 35 miles on streets or highway. I did not camp, opting to stay in AirBnB and hotels, allowing me to travel lighter plus have showers and good rest. My bike and I caught the Amtrak back to Kansas City.
I want to give a shout out to Platte County Parks 100 mile challenge for their brilliant idea to motivate residents to be active during COVID in 2020. They were unable to host the usual activities of organized bike rides and paddling events (due to COVID) so they challenged residents to complete 100 miles of activities in 100 days. That gave me the motivation to do it and I kept going. No way I would have ever considered doing anything like this a year ago. I lost 30 pounds and have improved my health.

Day one Westwood, KS to Pleasant Hill, MO 36 miles
Day two P Hill to Sedalia 71 miles
Day three Sedalia to Columbia 68 miles
Day four Columbia to Hermann 82 miles
Day five Hermann to St Charles 67 miles
Day six St Charles to St Louis 69 miles

way to go!

what was your route from westwood to pleasant hill.did use google maps

Cut and paste the link below to get details of the Garmin course. I did look at maps ahead of time, but I navigated most of this in my head. I tracked my route on my Garmin trip computer and saved it. I had no problems with traffic on a holiday Monday even though I had to wait a few moments to cross a couple streets.

https://connect.garmin.com/modern/course/75922391

If interested, here is my planned course from Kansas to Illinois and down to St Louis. I skipped Jeff City because it would have added about 8 miles to my 82 mile ride from COMO to Hermann.

https://connect.garmin.com/modern/course/76097473

Looking for recommendations on a 20 mile (10 miles out and 10 miles back) ride. My son and I have mountain bikes. Ideally, the ride would have a restaurant at the turn-around point. We'd like to start (and finish) somewhere mid-point on the trail. We're from Kansas City. We'd like to take this ride later this month.

Call the Globe Hotel Bed and Breakfast in Hartsburg, MO. (573)657-4529 for information.